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Author Topic: C.E.C SU-43  (Read 2308 times)

Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #75 on: March 10, 2010, 01:23:47 am »
I had always assumed it was a directional scanner that had its dish as part of the ventral hull, hence it being a "looking down" sensor for scanning the planet

Your right Braden that is exactly what it is.
you can't see it from the external view, but if you were to turn the ship upside down you would see a concaved sensor dish flush with the hull.
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #76 on: March 10, 2010, 01:50:08 am »
Ships bottom:


This is just a quick drawing showing what i mean.

Sensor dish:


This is a simple drawing showing what it would be like.
Its over 2 and a half meters high from the base of the dish to the top.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 02:30:58 am by Sharlin »
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Coolhand77

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #77 on: March 10, 2010, 02:37:56 am »
The reason the Blade has hers on top is that for planetary scans, she rolls and puts sensors to the planet, but when shes on the ground, they are aimed up for "sky scan" to keep ships from sneaking up on her
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VOID

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #78 on: March 10, 2010, 06:51:23 am »
That would make this system extremely inaccurate. The ship would have to manoeuvre into a geostationary orbit and it would have to compensate any inaccuracy by manoeuvring with the whole mass of the ship as an inertia inaccuracy factor.

Why not use a system with limited freedom of movement? Even the ability to turn no more than 10-20° would make it much more useful for planetary scans. Another option worth consideration would be a deployable satellite. A satellite would use a fixed array as well, yet it could arrange and aim itself with much more precision and it would hardly take up much more space than the current set-up. In addition, such a satellite could easily be mounted in a way that would retain the option to use it while it is docked with the ship in a way similar to what you got right now.
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Joz

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #79 on: March 10, 2010, 06:55:10 am »
I think I can simplify what void said.

Take the doors, put them under that sensor thing, and turn it into a sputnik, instead of the topside dish doors?

Just give it a power/data line on a fishing-reel type setup, and when the crew wants to, they just pop some commands into a computer, and open the doors and the probe can then use microbursts from its microthrusters to keep its position.


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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #80 on: March 10, 2010, 03:08:38 pm »
That would make this system extremely inaccurate. The ship would have to manoeuvre into a geostationary orbit and it would have to compensate any inaccuracy by manoeuvring with the whole mass of the ship as an inertia inaccuracy factor.

Why not use a system with limited freedom of movement? Even the ability to turn no more than 10-20° would make it much more useful for planetary scans. Another option worth consideration would be a deployable satellite. A satellite would use a fixed array as well, yet it could arrange and aim itself with much more precision and it would hardly take up much more space than the current set-up. In addition, such a satellite could easily be mounted in a way that would retain the option to use it while it is docked with the ship in a way similar to what you got right now.

I love the idea of the sensor being able to move a little, that makes sense.

I also love the idea of there being a detachable probe, that could be one of the options with this ship.

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VOID

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #81 on: March 10, 2010, 03:27:32 pm »
I've been thinking about this ship for a while now. What exactly is the ship's purpose? Sure, something archaeological. But what exactly? I'm just asking because I feel that whatever it is supposed to do exactly, it would not be able to do so in it's current layout. At least I could no think of anything.

For orbital archaeological survey it does not need any kind of lab equipment, but as many probes and satellites as possible and a wide range of optical and gravimetric sensors.
For anything involving lab equipment, it would need a lot of additional equipment that it cannot field as it is now. Ground survey equipment, ground transportation and digging equipment just to name a few. For that it lacks cargo capacity.
Recovery is not an option anyway, as the ship is not able to carry more than a few shards and splinters of anything.

So one way or another, the only thing it could actually do more or less is basic surface survey with an emphasis on basic. Squeezing in the equipment essential for anything beyond that will be quite a challenge.
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Joz

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #82 on: March 10, 2010, 03:47:24 pm »
Maybe add some external hardpoints for attaching cargo pods, or for towing a cargo sled even?
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #83 on: March 10, 2010, 04:07:25 pm »
I've been thinking about this ship for a while now. What exactly is the ship's purpose? Sure, something archaeological. But what exactly? I'm just asking because I feel that whatever it is supposed to do exactly, it would not be able to do so in it's current layout. At least I could no think of anything.

For orbital archaeological survey it does not need any kind of lab equipment, but as many probes and satellites as possible and a wide range of optical and gravimetric sensors.
For anything involving lab equipment, it would need a lot of additional equipment that it cannot field as it is now. Ground survey equipment, ground transportation and digging equipment just to name a few. For that it lacks cargo capacity.
Recovery is not an option anyway, as the ship is not able to carry more than a few shards and splinters of anything.

So one way or another, the only thing it could actually do more or less is basic surface survey with an emphasis on basic. Squeezing in the equipment essential for anything beyond that will be quite a challenge.

The SU-43 A is a mining scout, this ship will spend most of its time in space, only landing to pick up the odd rare sample.

The SU-43 B is an exploration scout its mission is to search planets for new and interesting life that will warrant sending a bigger fully equipped ship like the NOVA-DRIVE Y class.

The SU-43 C Which is the one you are talking about. is designed to search planets for any trace of a lost civilization.
If it found something interesting it would scan it, land and try to take samples, then send a bigger ship to investigate.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2010, 04:10:45 pm by Sharlin »
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VOID

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #84 on: March 10, 2010, 05:06:08 pm »
Mining scout:
The concept of mining scouts seems to be very common, but it is also widely misunderstood. A ship of that size and crew complement could serve either as a small economic geological survey vessel, or as a small prospector's ship. To do both, or to do either in more than basic detail, it is too small. If the ship is supposed to do basic economic geology survey, landing is neither required, nor useful. The most important thing to get that job done is detailed orbital multi-spectral imagery. The job of such a team would be to determine the geological structure of a planet, it's approximated age, map basic surface resources and so on. As a result, the sponsoring company would then know if the planet is useless, not interesting, interesting, or very interesting. It does not really get much more detailed than that. Even landing and taking diminutive samples would change much about that. To do more, a second team would have to be sent to worlds that were determined as interesting or better. This would be a prospector ship. The prospector ship would not really need any special onboard systems, except for cargo space and the data already collected by the geological survey team. The cargo space is needed for at least one all terrain vehicle, for light mobile drilling equipment and mobile sensor units and for loading samples. Analysing them on site would be possible for larger vessels, but it would not be practical nor useful for ships of this size.

Archaeology:
Most of what applies to economic geology applies to archaeology as well. The question whether or not there could be something worth looking at is determined from orbit. For more detail, atmospheric flights are useful. Actual landing only makes sense if the ship is equipped to do anything more useful than stepping outside and looking around on foot equipped with a shovel and a machete, which rarely does any good in a scientific sense. Archaeological robbery does work that way, but it will either have to rely on someone else's previous survey, or it will not be lucrative. Finding anything AND finding something valuable that is both easily recovered and easily moved is nearing impossible odds. So as for geological survey, it is either more useful to bring a bigger ship to begin with, or to specialize on a job that can actually be achieved. A ship that does lousy in everything it can do is not worth the fuel it uses.

You can use real-world historical and contemporary exploration and survey for inspiration. Keep in mind that even the explorers of the new world had much more knowledge of what they would find than anyone who flies to an uncharted planet. They may often not have realized it, but they were already aware of the general information. The Americas were still planet earth, after all. Plants were green and grew upwards, mountains were made of similar rock than they already knew and formed by the same forces. Still, even dedicated expeditions brought a lot of multi-functional equipment and manpower. Much much more than such a small starship could field. Even dedicated modern geological survey teams work with more personnel and equipment. Most of what I know about that, I know because my mother is working for the economic geology department of the Berlin Free University. Only the most tiny areas of research can be conducted by teams smaller than a dozen and without complex equipment. Things like collecting data on a specific volcano, for example. Nothing like that would justify sending a starship anywhere, though.

I hope you don't take any of this for negative feedback, because it is most definitely not meant to be.
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #85 on: March 10, 2010, 06:52:24 pm »
All these ship are designed as the basic scout, there mission is to point a company in the direction of an interesting planet.

I hope you don't take any of this for negative feedback, because it is most definitely not meant to be.
As for negative feedback, what you have written falls well within the confines of constructive criticism, which is always welcome.
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #86 on: March 19, 2010, 01:59:19 am »
SU-43 A interior update:


SU-43 B interior update:


I have changed the position of the doors to make entering the bed rooms easier.

I have also changed the computer room slightly.

NOTE: i am dropping the C variant because i think VOID is right, the ship is too small to be used for Archaeology.
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #87 on: May 19, 2010, 11:11:48 pm »
SU-43 A update:
   

SU-43 B update:
       

Fitted a new 70mm mass driver.
Also fitted extra repulsors.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2010, 11:36:23 pm by Sharlin »
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Sharlin

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Re: C.E.C SU-43
« Reply #88 on: September 07, 2010, 04:51:54 pm »
Update A:
   

Update B:
   

Fitted see though glass to cockpit,
i had to redesign the cockpit canopy because the pilot would not have been able to look left or right without standing up,
also the forward vision was terrible.
This will also have to be done with the CU-37 as it is the same cockpit.
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